Episode 8
Cruise Pioneers | Estonia's Smart Maritime Vision, with Trade Estonia
This week on Cruise Pioneers, Birgit Liodden is joined by Kaupo Läänerand, Estonia’s Deputy Minister for Maritime and Water Affairs. With over a decade of hands-on maritime experience and a background in managing the largest government-owned fleet in Estonia, Kaupo brings a unique, systems-level perspective to the future of ocean innovation.
Together, they explore Estonia’s bold leadership in maritime sustainability, digitalisation, and smart technologies—from AI integration in industry, to pioneering smart port and ship solutions. Kaupo shares how Estonia is power-coupling across the maritime value chain.
Addressing unresolved challenges of green retrofitting, digital bottlenecks, and cybersecurity—and how Estonia’s €25 million grant for green ship retrofits opens the door for cruise lines and startups to co-create radical solutions.
The episode highlights real opportunities for cruise lines and Estonian innovators to co-create solutions in areas like shore power, cybersecurity, and circular shipbuilding towards a sustainable future for cruise.
This podcast was brought to you by Trade Estonia and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Estonia. Funded by the European Union–NextGenerationEU.
Find out more at Visit Trade Estonia
Mentioned in this episode:
This podcast was brought to you by Trade Estonia and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Estonia.
About Trade Estonia: Trade Estonia connects enterprises to a dynamic, innovation-driven economy, providing access to global markets. Trade Estonia is part of Enterprise Estonia, a government extension connecting Estonian companies with business partners across the world. Trade Estonia also serves as a gateway for foreign enterprises seeking sourcing opportunities in Estonia, offering e-consulting services and facilitating connections with leading Estonian companies. Discover more at tradewithestonia.com
Transcript
>> Speaker A: From sustainable ship design and retrofitting
Speaker:to smart port technologies, Estonia
Speaker:leads the way in maritime innovation
Speaker:at Seatrade Trade Cruise Global Match to meet
Speaker:Estonian companies that make the maritime industry
Speaker:smarter or learn
Speaker:more@tradewithestonia.com.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Welcome to the Cruise Pioneers podcast by
Speaker:tool hosted on Seatrade Trade Cruise
Speaker:Talks podcasts.
Speaker:Hello, I'm Birgit Liodin, Sustainability
Speaker:Ambassador of Seatrade Trade and founder of the Ocean
Speaker:Opportunity Lab. In this new series we will dive
Speaker:into the pioneering initiatives of cruise lines and
Speaker:entrepreneurs who move and change the cruise
Speaker:industry. We focus on real life frontrunner
Speaker:initiatives and power couples enabling
Speaker:crews to move from pollution to
Speaker:solution. Get on board our shared expedition as
Speaker:we get behind the scenes and explore
Speaker:how owners, founders and top
Speaker:executives move from vision to
Speaker:deployment. Today I am so excited
Speaker:to bring into our studio
Speaker:Kaupo Lanrant, Estonia's Deputy
Speaker:Minister for Maritime and Water affairs at the Ministry of
Speaker:Climate. In his role he
Speaker:oversees most of the blue economy sectors and water
Speaker:management in Estonia. Mr.
Speaker:Lannerand previously served as head of fleet for
Speaker:the Estonian police on border guard board
Speaker:where he managed the biggest government owned fleet.
Speaker:He also has extensive knowledge of the maritime
Speaker:industry from his experience working on board
Speaker:tankers and the world's largest treasures for
Speaker:more than a decade. So welcome to
Speaker:us. I am so excited to start
Speaker:our conversation talking about your
Speaker:pioneer commitment.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: Hello. Great to be here.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: So the blue industries of Estonia has
Speaker:really stepped up over these past years
Speaker:and can you share with us a little bit both
Speaker:from Estonia's national commitment
Speaker:to sustainability and the pioneer role and include
Speaker:a little bit of what makes you tick when it comes
Speaker:to this area.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: My role is actually to
Speaker:be the let's say its most strategic position
Speaker:for policymaking. So let's
Speaker:say the Ministry of Climate where all
Speaker:the maritime policy is let's say
Speaker:made. It's placed somewhere where
Speaker:the maritime sector meets with
Speaker:university and also the
Speaker:citizens needs meet with others.
Speaker:So we are the place where everything comes
Speaker:together. and as maritime nation Estonia has
Speaker:been very sea focused for many
Speaker:years and we
Speaker:love the forest and we love the sea as well.
Speaker:So we have a lot of companies
Speaker:which has grown to be global and
Speaker:average Estonian likes to
Speaker:sail, they like to go on holiday near the sea
Speaker:like everyone else. And of course our
Speaker:winters are longer so we cannot compare
Speaker:it to Florida, Florida winters. but
Speaker:we are still a strong maritime nation and we
Speaker:see our strength in strong
Speaker:export and this is export of
Speaker:knowledge. This is export of high quality
Speaker:industry products and other types of
Speaker:products. So we can from Estonian side we can
Speaker:never compete with let's say South Korea for
Speaker:building huge vessels but we are very
Speaker:good at building vessels up to 70, 80
Speaker:metres which are high level, highly
Speaker:automated and highly, highly
Speaker:digitalized. And you bring in the
Speaker:numbers then Estonian blue economy is
Speaker:responsible up to 5% of GDP, national
Speaker:GDP which shows how big part it
Speaker:plays from our economy.
Speaker:And yeah this is maybe for start.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Yeah. And you're known as a country and a
Speaker:maritime nation to be very tech savvy. And
Speaker:then I wonder about the, the current progress when
Speaker:we look at your, your targets from
Speaker:Estonia. Can you mention if there are
Speaker:specific areas when we look at the sustainable blue
Speaker:shift where you are ahead of your
Speaker:targets and are there any specific areas that
Speaker:you have experienced to be challenging, representing
Speaker:bottlenecks? And then of course I'm you know thinking
Speaker:of this in also a
Speaker:context.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: Yes, challenges are definitely
Speaker:there. when I first bring up the challenges
Speaker:then for example we
Speaker:are facing
Speaker:European Union green deal requirements
Speaker:which we have fuel, maritime EU, we have
Speaker:maritime ETS for ships bigger than 5,000
Speaker:cross tonnage. So we have those regulations, we have
Speaker:IMO greenhouse gas strategy coming in and
Speaker:we have national targets. So actually we have those three
Speaker:sets of targets and to fulfil
Speaker:those lot of investments are needed.
Speaker:And one example is
Speaker:that grid, electrical grid in the
Speaker:ports, which a lot of people think that
Speaker:okay we are building the ships to be on green
Speaker:technology. So basically we just need to re
Speaker:retrofit the vessels or build a new vessel. But
Speaker:actually from our case the electrical grid
Speaker:is challenged because it's
Speaker:expensive work to do. And when you have, I don't
Speaker:know in the ports where historically
Speaker:you have five rope packs vessels, five cruise
Speaker:vessels coming in and now you need to bring them
Speaker:more on electricity than
Speaker:this national electricity grid or this let's
Speaker:say regional grid has never been developed
Speaker:to, to bring all those massive ships
Speaker:to electricity. So this is
Speaker:definitely challenging. One is the
Speaker:labour wars. we need better
Speaker:prepared for green technology, better prepared crew
Speaker:members of the ships. And definitely
Speaker:the green
Speaker:shift is or blue shift for
Speaker:blue economy it's it's costing a lot for ship
Speaker:owners. So for them it's also
Speaker:challenging to push them to make the
Speaker:first shift. but we have a Lot of initiatives,
Speaker:and lot of pilot projects where as
Speaker:government we are pushing the
Speaker:maritime sector and supporting them or nudging
Speaker:them, to choose the direction to reduce
Speaker:emissions and increase the efficiency.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: And I mean you tap directly into what
Speaker:I see to be like the sore spot of
Speaker:almost all the people that I talk with on this pod as
Speaker:well. The access to clean energy
Speaker:and the current grid capacity issues of
Speaker:course is such a huge headache
Speaker:for many actors out there. And then of
Speaker:course that provides a very exciting
Speaker:role for the innovators out there
Speaker:all across the different parts of our industry.
Speaker:And I know that your country has a great track
Speaker:record on fueling the startup
Speaker:ecosystem across different industries. And
Speaker:I wanted to check in your perspectives on
Speaker:what we call power couples where we look
Speaker:at the high potential areas and the
Speaker:exciting initiatives where large
Speaker:organisations, public and private stakeholders
Speaker:team up with smaller startups to
Speaker:more radically tackle and solve
Speaker:these key bottlenecks that we are
Speaker:experiencing in our blue society.
Speaker:So I wanted to hear where it is that you see
Speaker:as specifically good and well
Speaker:positioned areas for this power coupling
Speaker:between startups and the large
Speaker:stakeholders from Estonian perspective.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: We have a lot of good examples in here. maybe I would
Speaker:like to start. This was one of our initiatives from ministry
Speaker:also that we have fairly new
Speaker:Estonian Maritime Cluster. So Estonian
Speaker:Maritime Cluster is let's say a little bit more than
Speaker:one year old and it's
Speaker:bringing together the maritime
Speaker:companies, the big companies which are
Speaker:making huge revenues and also the small
Speaker:startups into the one system. And ID was
Speaker:from the beginning to have big partner for government
Speaker:that Estonian companies can join up in
Speaker:export markets as well. And sometimes
Speaker:smaller ones find through these kind
Speaker:of communities like clusters they can meet each
Speaker:other. So Estonian Maritime cluster has
Speaker:around 60 members after one year as
Speaker:companies and already with
Speaker:around 2 billion euro of yearly
Speaker:revenue. So they have grown growth, they
Speaker:had very fast growth in the first year and
Speaker:we look them to come together as
Speaker:well and they already helped. They were
Speaker:our partner with Estonian Retrofit
Speaker:and greentech Hub. So basically
Speaker:we are like industry, and government,
Speaker:working closely and visionizing how
Speaker:we can make the changes happen.
Speaker:And together with them through Maritime
Speaker:Cluster we have prepared this 25 million
Speaker:euro retrofit measure so
Speaker:to invite ships for example to
Speaker:Estonian ports and use our
Speaker:industry knowledge to retrofit the vessels.
Speaker:And we pay back to the ship owners
Speaker:15 to 30% of their investment. So this
Speaker:is like those Shipowners who are
Speaker:in between, it's a great chance for
Speaker:them in between to making the investment decision.
Speaker:This should be our nudging, to help
Speaker:them to really retrofit the vessels to
Speaker:new technologies. Other great example may
Speaker:be how industry and big
Speaker:players and smaller players are working together
Speaker:is Port of Tallinn. between Helsink and
Speaker:Tallinn we have this very ambitious green corridor.
Speaker:I'm personally big believer of green corridors. I
Speaker:think the green corridors are critical for
Speaker:really decarbonizing the maritime industry because
Speaker:you have to connect the dots because you cannot build
Speaker:the infrastructure and all the fuels
Speaker:everywhere. You have to start with green
Speaker:corridors, tile in Helsinki. Then you go for tile in
Speaker:Stockholm, then you have Stockholm, Helsinki Triangle.
Speaker:Then you go for for example Rotterdam tiling,
Speaker:green corridor and you start to connect those dots.
Speaker:You have electricity availability,
Speaker:methanol, something else.
Speaker:So green corridors are bases. And what we did
Speaker:is there was Estonian startup this time
Speaker:startup. Now they are top three players called
Speaker:Shorlink and Estonian.
Speaker:Tallinn Port wanted to bring their
Speaker:big rope vessels to
Speaker:electricity and they needed
Speaker:some supplier for those technologies. And there
Speaker:was a startup called Shorlink who is visiting also the
Speaker:US with delegation and they made the systems
Speaker:ready. And now with this 10
Speaker:million passenger traffic flow
Speaker:port, now it's using those Shorelink
Speaker:devices, ops, systems
Speaker:and this helped the Shorelink also to grow
Speaker:and now they are really producing
Speaker:to Middle east, to
Speaker:Europe, to across the world all those ops
Speaker:systems and they went to the cruise industry. They
Speaker:started to scale up their work. So this is great
Speaker:example where this for example national
Speaker:owned company, Port of Tallinn M. Let's say we
Speaker:are as government 66% owner of this
Speaker:port of Tallinn and how we can work
Speaker:together and really the green technologies industry
Speaker:can also grow. So a lot of, lot of the
Speaker:great examples there. And this port
Speaker:of Tallinn, it's maybe there is
Speaker:smart port solution there used. I don't know. Have
Speaker:you Birgit, have you visited port of Tallinn and used the
Speaker:smart port? But in the past there was a lot of
Speaker:people in the port showing where to go, you need to
Speaker:wait in the queue. And now it's completely
Speaker:automized. All the systems are interacting
Speaker:with each other and you go to port, port, you almost
Speaker:don't have any human interaction and you go
Speaker:straight away to port the vessel. So
Speaker:those are good examples how we can be more
Speaker:efficient in all ways.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Yeah. So green corridors and
Speaker:the tech revolution. Really. I
Speaker:couldn't agree more with your points. I think both on
Speaker:the green corridor as a
Speaker:model for enabling this
Speaker:transition, but also of course utilising the best
Speaker:of new tech. Are there any other
Speaker:especially interesting companies that you are bringing
Speaker:over from Estonia this year?
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: Yeah, we have a
Speaker:company called Inspirators and I
Speaker:think one of their mottos was to take
Speaker:away job from 20,000 engineers or
Speaker:something. the idea was that actually they want
Speaker:to free up those engineers. A lot of
Speaker:engineers are doing work which could be done
Speaker:by AI and machines.
Speaker:so let's say easy, designs and
Speaker:works and they are offering solutions
Speaker:where you can really free up this
Speaker:workforce and give engineers to do something
Speaker:better. So they are coming as well. Port of
Speaker:Tallinn is coming as I mentioned, Shorlink and
Speaker:and we have this small mini
Speaker:cluster called Emmy who has like full
Speaker:value offer chain, to retrofit the vessels.
Speaker:And I think they have very good value offer
Speaker:for retrofitting cruise vessels because they have
Speaker:like machine side cover, interior
Speaker:side cover. and I think the
Speaker:interior is very, let's say it's very
Speaker:underestimated part of green transition.
Speaker:To give you example, Estonian companies are looking the
Speaker:ways, how to reduce emissions together with
Speaker:cruise vessel owners and they actually have Estonia
Speaker:Valley offered. We have possibility to
Speaker:change the interior of cabins, for example
Speaker:of cruise vessels and reduce the weight of the
Speaker:cabin 200 kilos. So when you
Speaker:have cruise vessels of 3,000 cabins,
Speaker:you change it with new modern
Speaker:materials and you can have
Speaker:600 tonnes of less of weight which you are
Speaker:carrying. So this 600 tonnes of weight
Speaker:total with the 3,000 cabin retrofitting, of course
Speaker:beautiful materials, you can also
Speaker:reduce your emissions and this is important
Speaker:for ship owners to fulfil the regulations. So
Speaker:this is, I think what I mentioned is 25
Speaker:million euro retrofit measurements coming out by
Speaker:Estonia in April. Actually it should come out
Speaker:in the time when I'm in US to bring ship
Speaker:owners, to nurse the ship owners to be more green. This
Speaker:retrofitting can be also part of the
Speaker:works and maybe we have big
Speaker:innovators coming in. They are called
Speaker:src. When I was in Singapore
Speaker:last week, they have already
Speaker:confirmation from classification
Speaker:societies that this technology is great.
Speaker:So they are bringing into the US the
Speaker:methanol super storage. So this
Speaker:is this company actually has solved
Speaker:one of the great challenges of retrofitting ships to
Speaker:methanol we don't have capacity to build all the
Speaker:new ships. We need to retrofit them. That's why we are putting
Speaker:our ambitions to there. So what was
Speaker:three pillars of methanol to bring
Speaker:to retrofit the vessels to Metanov? One is to have
Speaker:methanol engines. This is all the
Speaker:methanol engines that are coming on the market.
Speaker:the production will be growing. other
Speaker:was fuel availability. Let's say
Speaker:this, you need to have enough
Speaker:clients and the investments will be there. This is
Speaker:challenging part but you have to
Speaker:most probably solve it through green
Speaker:corridors through mutual
Speaker:contracts. And the third was the
Speaker:methanol takes three times more space than
Speaker:fossil fuels to get same amount. So ship owner still wants
Speaker:to voyage all those same distances. What they
Speaker:did before, they need same amount of energy and the
Speaker:problem is that with existing technologies they
Speaker:can only get one third of the distance. So
Speaker:SRC solved it and they have solution
Speaker:as I mentioned called metal super storage.
Speaker:And this solves everything
Speaker:in this regard. So they can take same
Speaker:amount of fuel energy on
Speaker:board and take in all the methanol. And
Speaker:why the methanol is important. I think
Speaker:personally that methanol and ammonia
Speaker:and electricity will be the main three big
Speaker:players in the green fuels in the coming
Speaker:years. So I hope
Speaker:that all the companies visiting us
Speaker:can learn more about them.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: I think they have a lot of really interesting
Speaker:pioneering initiatives from Estonia to look
Speaker:into. And I really love the fact that you guys
Speaker:focus so much on the retrofit part because of course and I think
Speaker:you also coming from the industry yourself,
Speaker:we can't really new build our way into
Speaker:to solve this. so, so it's highly
Speaker:interesting and also a great challenge for the
Speaker:established stakeholder governments and for the small
Speaker:startups to find these progressive new
Speaker:solutions to work with. Circular economy and
Speaker:different type of retrofits that will help our
Speaker:industry really move through the right direction
Speaker:and deliver both on national and
Speaker:European continental ambitions.
Speaker:And then I wanted to check in
Speaker:with you because now you mentioned a
Speaker:lot of the really great initiatives that you
Speaker:have where there is a true power couple,
Speaker:modus of operandis. So when we
Speaker:work with these topics and I think you
Speaker:touched briefly upon one of them with the sure
Speaker:power thing. But we also ask our
Speaker:guests to share with the audience a bit
Speaker:about currently unresolved pain points
Speaker:where we are looking for specific
Speaker:additional area where you have these great
Speaker:commitments and where you're really eager
Speaker:to see the partnering of cruise
Speaker:lines and entrepreneurs for new solutions
Speaker:beyond those that are.
Speaker:>> Speaker A: Already based in Northern Europe.
Speaker:Estonia is the gateway to responsible and
Speaker:innovative maritime practises at Seatrade
Speaker:Trade Cruise Global Match to meet Estonian
Speaker:companies that drive maritime safety,
Speaker:reduce emissions and make the maritime industry
Speaker:smarter. Or learn
Speaker:more@tradewithastonia.com.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Work in progress.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: It's a great question and I
Speaker:can reply with
Speaker:with let's say challenge
Speaker:and let's say the
Speaker:points where we need to improve but also the
Speaker:solution. So I am the person of solutions. So
Speaker:let's open up the electrical grid was
Speaker:challenged. So we are looking ways how to
Speaker:support by government also
Speaker:those investments and to support industry
Speaker:for them to be more ready because the ports are also
Speaker:different. Some ports are more
Speaker:ambitions. Some ports are like okay we
Speaker:can still go fossil for many years and
Speaker:when the demand will be there. So so
Speaker:some are thinking that the train they see
Speaker:train already moving that but they don't start to run it.
Speaker:So we tried to get them on board
Speaker:as well. other was really to bring the companies
Speaker:together. That was in the past problem and
Speaker:this one I really took as my
Speaker:really personal initiative to bring the maritime industry
Speaker:together. So now we have maritime cluster and
Speaker:we need to support them growing because we
Speaker:are so small country. So to go
Speaker:export and go with full value chain and to
Speaker:offer the solutions then we need to work
Speaker:together then the future labour
Speaker:force. This is something where we try
Speaker:to support industry and
Speaker:universities as well. One of the things
Speaker:from government side what I really see
Speaker:that we talked about those old startups
Speaker:growing and really conquering the
Speaker:world. we have more than 10 unicorns
Speaker:in Estonia most in it and
Speaker:unicorn is more than 1 billion euro of companies.
Speaker:so really I would like to see one of
Speaker:them in maritime as well.
Speaker:And the key word is pilot
Speaker:projects by government or together with
Speaker:industry. So that is why we are going
Speaker:out with procurement to build new fully electric
Speaker:ferry we are building
Speaker:biomethane multipurpose vessel.
Speaker:So those are the possibilities for companies
Speaker:to get references as well to
Speaker:really grow and learn. For example Estonia
Speaker:built first a hybrid petrol vessel in the
Speaker:past. So usually
Speaker:everybody are focusing to other sectors and
Speaker:about pilot projects. What is one of the
Speaker:key ambitions? we have a lot of companies like
Speaker:Mindchip who was together with me in Singapore as well
Speaker:who are building those autonomous vessels
Speaker:and Their aim is to take away the work
Speaker:from the people when you don't actually need the people.
Speaker:So in the maritime you need to, for example you need
Speaker:to survey your sea area all the time.
Speaker:We are doing it with huge
Speaker:manned vessels who are using for example
Speaker:fossil fuels. So our ambitions by
Speaker:government, again with pilot projects, is to build
Speaker:a fleet of survey vessels, autonomous small
Speaker:survey vessels and you can have them 10 in line
Speaker:to working like in the lines and making the
Speaker:survey work much more efficient, less
Speaker:emissions and more cost effective.
Speaker:So all kind of these projects are
Speaker:needed to help. And the other
Speaker:is our aim was again the problem
Speaker:was we don't know so much what's going around in the
Speaker:water. So we are also
Speaker:together with industry, making Seawolf
Speaker:project where we want to create maritime digital
Speaker:twin so we can understand what is happening
Speaker:under the water, top of the water. This can be security,
Speaker:this can be environment, this can be all
Speaker:the systems together. So we are developing this one
Speaker:as well. Again this is great chance
Speaker:for pilot projects, great chance for references
Speaker:and let's see how it ends
Speaker:up. because there are sensors there, you
Speaker:know, you can detect oil. we
Speaker:have big oil threat in the Baltic Seatrade with the Shadow
Speaker:fleet and all the substandard fleet.
Speaker:And they can really help us to detect the oil
Speaker:and react faster, get the evidence.
Speaker:and scientists in the future, they don't have
Speaker:to go and take the examples
Speaker:of the water in exact time. They
Speaker:can get the peak data all the time. So
Speaker:pilot projects is key I think to
Speaker:really make the changes happen from my
Speaker:side. And of course one of the things
Speaker:what I really look into is offshore wind.
Speaker:One moment offshore wind
Speaker:was the direction, other moment a lot of
Speaker:critics on offshore wind. So now
Speaker:again they talk about offshore wind. I can say
Speaker:certain, I'm big believer of offshore wind. We
Speaker:have 9 gigawatts of potential in here in our
Speaker:sea area. So this would be great
Speaker:chance for ship fuels to be developed and
Speaker:use this, all this excess energy to
Speaker:really make those fuels for shipping as well. So
Speaker:I hope this one goes well ahead as well.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Absolutely. And I just have to ask, first of all,
Speaker:I have to applaud you for the amazing
Speaker:initiatives that you're doing in your role for the government.
Speaker:And then I also wonder, circling back to
Speaker:the, to the grid issue and alternative
Speaker:new energy sources. Are you also looking into
Speaker:any other ways of expanding your
Speaker:grid Capacity with what we call more breathing
Speaker:grid structures and finding other innovative
Speaker:solutions to gain energy from the
Speaker:ocean to support the capacity issues in the
Speaker:ports.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: Yeah, M. I can tell you that
Speaker:the forerunner ports are they are
Speaker:using already solar panels and
Speaker:smaller ports as well. This is going up the
Speaker:use of solar energy, wind energy.
Speaker:We have one big project for one of our biggest
Speaker:ports to use this, to get the heat and
Speaker:also the cooling from the seawater.
Speaker:So those are expensive projects and it's bringing again
Speaker:new challenges because our sea
Speaker:floor, one side we have electrical grids, then we
Speaker:have all those pipes in the seafloor. So this will bring
Speaker:us new challenges and you need to get them working
Speaker:together. So we are harnessing that. We
Speaker:are harnessing a lot of offshore energy in the future.
Speaker:But because the tides in Estonia are not so
Speaker:high, so tidal energy is not in the
Speaker:topic. We have a lot of bad weather,
Speaker:so we should use more wave energy.
Speaker:But this is not, let's say not in the
Speaker:focus at the moment. I really see that
Speaker:this wave energy we are looking into these
Speaker:smart floating platforms which are part
Speaker:of the Seawolf system, what I mentioned. So
Speaker:I have seen the solutions where the wave
Speaker:energy is loading the batteries
Speaker:on board of the systems at sea. If this really
Speaker:works, I will be interesting to know it more.
Speaker:But, but yeah, at the moment
Speaker:those are the main directions.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Yeah, I mean the wave energy has been, you know,
Speaker:under, under invested and still early.
Speaker:But I think for all of us who are really ocean
Speaker:nerds, it's such a
Speaker:magical perspective to, to look at. Like
Speaker:when and how will we truly be able to take
Speaker:out all of the boundless,
Speaker:amounts of energy from the waves that we're sailing
Speaker:on. And then of course you touched upon
Speaker:it, in the whole perspective of
Speaker:digitization and efficiency. We
Speaker:are facing as an industry both now
Speaker:and for the time ahead, a huge
Speaker:shortage of the access to talents because
Speaker:we, we compete with so many other
Speaker:industries and very many young
Speaker:people and experts out there don't
Speaker:necessarily look to the ocean and maritime sector and
Speaker:cruise when they are making their career
Speaker:moves. personally I have a huge
Speaker:belief in when we bring in clean
Speaker:energy transition, when we bring in innovators,
Speaker:kind of new faces and new role
Speaker:models and more exciting
Speaker:solutions that are brought out to younger people
Speaker:out there that will also help making an
Speaker:impact. While we'll also have to find smart
Speaker:solutions so that we can utilise people
Speaker:and their capacities better than what we have done.
Speaker:But we have our last last
Speaker:insight that we ask from, from all of our guests
Speaker:that is focusing on tomorrow's talents today. And I know
Speaker:you guys are working a lot on this because we
Speaker:do need so many great people and brains
Speaker:and hands on board with us to build this future of
Speaker:cruise. And I would love to
Speaker:hear if you can share your personal
Speaker:hack or advice to talents who
Speaker:are listening in existing industry colleagues.
Speaker:what do you see as ah kind of
Speaker:capabilities and skill sets that
Speaker:is truly needed to be part of building
Speaker:this cruise. Pioneers and the
Speaker:sustainable clean transition of the maritime sector
Speaker:onwards.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: This challenge is hard because we all face
Speaker:it especially while the welfare is very
Speaker:good, especially those countries. And they are fulfilling the
Speaker:gap with at the moment around the world with getting
Speaker:the talents from other countries.
Speaker:but there has to
Speaker:be other solution for that. And
Speaker:it's like always in the life the answer
Speaker:lies in a combination of different things. What
Speaker:we need to do. One of the ways
Speaker:to bring in more talents still bring them
Speaker:into the maritime industry. I think it's
Speaker:clear career path and potential.
Speaker:So at the moment for example a lot of tech officers,
Speaker:engineers, electronical officers, a lot
Speaker:of them don't want to go to, to the sea anymore. Actually
Speaker:they would like to sail 10 to
Speaker:20 years but they see that they
Speaker:cannot. They don't want to work there until end of the
Speaker:day. So one of the ways
Speaker:is really to show them
Speaker:if they go to learn in academy then
Speaker:they see that there are let's say two
Speaker:career options or three career options. When
Speaker:they, when they study they already prepare
Speaker:to work ashore as well that they always know
Speaker:that the knowledge and the
Speaker:diploma what they get they will. It helps for
Speaker:them if they want to come to work ashore. There
Speaker:is clear I don't know two, three
Speaker:scenarios where they can be technical
Speaker:management. They can really go
Speaker:for green technologies industries. So this
Speaker:is really important because I'm myself with tech
Speaker:officer background. I never planned to come to work
Speaker:as vice ministers as well. So
Speaker:this just happened like That so
Speaker:they need to know more about that. Second
Speaker:is to catch them as young as possible.
Speaker:It's hard to get somebody to love sea
Speaker:and waves and when they are already
Speaker:18 years old. We need to catch them earlier.
Speaker:So that is why our focus
Speaker:are. We have around 237
Speaker:ports in Estonia. Most of them are smaller one as
Speaker:well. So One of the things what we are doing
Speaker:and solution for that as well is to
Speaker:bring young people to ports. Is it
Speaker:recreational activities, trainings, is it sailing?
Speaker:Is it somebody some other hobbies to
Speaker:get them to the port and get them
Speaker:to involve their hobbies
Speaker:which is part of the maritime. And
Speaker:we need to infect them with maritime.
Speaker:Exactly. as early as possible.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: So this is basically
Speaker:racing and growing ocean lovers.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: Yes. So get them as
Speaker:young as possible to the port,
Speaker:provide potential, bring them
Speaker:in and these are the ways definitely do
Speaker:it. And the maritime industry imago
Speaker:and the great
Speaker:potential behind it because what I have in
Speaker:my role has done also that
Speaker:When I came to the ministry it seems like
Speaker:everybody talked that it's you know maritime
Speaker:industry or maritime sector. Generally it's ship
Speaker:and port but this is much more. It's
Speaker:about growing the seaweed. It's
Speaker:recreational activities. It's offshore
Speaker:wind, we don't know, maybe it's even
Speaker:mining in the future. it's all the IT
Speaker:solutions for maritime all those
Speaker:green technology producers. Shipbuilding
Speaker:retrofitting is completely
Speaker:other parallel world of shipbuilding.
Speaker:So there are so many, it's so
Speaker:wide part of our economies especially maritime
Speaker:nations that to really to make them understand
Speaker:that into how big ecosystem they are
Speaker:entering if they are choosing the maritime. So
Speaker:this awareness of the scale
Speaker:of it as well.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: Oh I definitely agree with you And I think
Speaker:your journey as well is so interesting. To move from like
Speaker:a clear red sea and a deck of officer and then
Speaker:becoming a vice minister. I think that's also something that
Speaker:really shows the opportunity space out
Speaker:there. And based on your own journey,
Speaker:Kaupo, what do you think has been kind of
Speaker:the personal
Speaker:skill in you that has
Speaker:enabled this really exciting
Speaker:journey that could be inspiration for
Speaker:younger talents out there.
Speaker:>> Kaupo Lannerand: What drives me? I don't know. People have to
Speaker:find what drives them. Somebody are doing it for money,
Speaker:somebody is doing for the hobby.
Speaker:If the hobby is the work. I know a lot of people in our
Speaker:industry who is. It's like hobby their work. So this
Speaker:is the best solution. One of the most
Speaker:interesting also when I was head of coast car fleet
Speaker:this was very interesting time as well.
Speaker:I received huge in this crazy
Speaker:geopolitical world where we are living at the moment,
Speaker:and so many things happening around the world. So I
Speaker:think it's great that I worked one moment in my life as
Speaker:head of CoastCorflight because this really helps to
Speaker:prepare for the crisis as well, but for
Speaker:me, I think that what drives me the
Speaker:most and people have to find
Speaker:it, is, to make big
Speaker:changes happen. So I really, I
Speaker:enjoy. Is it consolidation of government
Speaker:on fleet or big initiatives, so
Speaker:really that you can sit on the couch 20 years
Speaker:later, drink your coffee, and think
Speaker:that I have made, together with my team and together,
Speaker:maritime sector, some big changes happen. So this is
Speaker:what drives me.
Speaker:>> Birgit Liodden: I think that's a great end to our
Speaker:conversation today. And, I'm really looking
Speaker:forward to catch up and, really
Speaker:explore all of the amazing stakeholders that are
Speaker:gathered from Estonia for sea trade.
Speaker:And thank you so much for taking the time to
Speaker:sit in with us today. And, let's stay tuned
Speaker:on all of the exciting stuff going on from the
Speaker:Estonian maritime sector. So thank you.
